Hate Watching K-Pax: Good, Bad or just Non Sense?

Someone shows up in Grand Central, claims he’s from a planet called K-Pax, and calmly starts wrecking everyone’s certainty. That setup sounds like classic sci-fi, but the more we talk about the 2001 film K-Pax, the more it turns into a debate about story logic, emotional truth, and what “proof” even means when a person is clearly suffering. One of us watches Prot (Kevin Spacey) and sees a fragile psychological mystery with a trauma core. The other sees a movie that dodges tension, ignores consequences, and stitches together scenes that don’t quite click.

We break down the big beats that make K-Pax so polarizing: the psychiatric ward as a strange little community, Jeff Bridges’ therapist walking the line between clinical skepticism and personal longing, the planetarium sequence that feels like undeniable evidence, and the blue bird moment that turns into a full-building celebration. We also get into the film’s loose rules about alien abilities, why the lack of outside scrutiny feels off, and how the movie’s “cures” can come across as a troubling take on mental health treatment, including its flirtation with regression hypnosis.

Then the story pivots into the Santa Rosa backstory, the sprinkler trigger, and the line that sums up the whole experience: “I found what I was looking for. I wish I hadn’t.” We close with bonus hate watching (Mindy Kaling’s Not Suitable For Work), a quick shot of World Cup joy, and what we’re watching next: Spielberg’s War of the Worlds. If you like movie podcasts that argue hard but stay curious, subscribe, share this with a friend who still defends K-Pax, and leave us a review.

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Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

Well, this was like a four and a half pager, so we gotta we gotta get it.

SPEAKER_03 0:03

I took zero notes. Yeah, I know. I had my note thing open, took no notes. You know? Fell back to a simpler time, as they say.

SPEAKER_02 0:12

Yeah. Making someone else do all the work. Yep, simpler time. Mom, wash my clothes. Dan, teach me discipline.

SPEAKER_01 0:21

Hey, watch it! I'm watching!

Welcome To Hate Watching

SPEAKER_01 0:33

Welcome to Hate Watching with Dan and Tony.

SPEAKER_02 0:36

I am Dan.

SPEAKER_03 0:38

And I am Tony.

SPEAKER_02 0:40

Um, on this show, we watch a movie that has been that has been left on the shelf to become perfectly seasoned. So that when you look at it from the from the future, you look back into the past and you're like, wow, what how did they know all these things? How did they know that these magical characters that they would create would just continue to resonate through the ages?

SPEAKER_03 1:03

Sometimes things just hit, as they say. You know? It's a point in time, a cultural zeitgeist. We all come together and share love.

SPEAKER_02 1:13

Yeah. Um, Tony, why don't you tell us about the movie we're talking about today?

SPEAKER_03 1:18

Well, you picked it, but I'll tell you all about it.

SPEAKER_02 1:22

I did pick this movie. Kevin Spacey, a favorite of the channel. We watched him in the cat movie, right? We've only done him in the cat movie.

SPEAKER_03 1:31

Nine lives, yeah. Just uh just an absolute classic.

SPEAKER_02 1:35

Which of course I thought he was the bad guy in Catwoman, which of course he isn't the bad. I mean, Sharon Stone's the bad guy in Catwoman. Duh.

Choosing K-Pax And First Reactions

SPEAKER_02 1:43

The movie I picked was from 2001, K-PEx coming in at two hours even. Um touch shorter. This was very hard to watch. At the beginning, I was just like, I could watch maybe five to seven minutes.

SPEAKER_03 2:00

Interesting.

SPEAKER_02 2:01

And then it so at the end, I just like I powered through the last 40 minutes last night, and I was just like, I'm gonna get it done. I'm not gonna I just want it over with yesterday. I didn't want to deal with it this morning.

SPEAKER_03 2:11

Unreal. I was in heaven this whole time. Uh love, I loved I love every second of this movie, but it's interesting because Naomi, right, my wife, right next to me, my partner, she checked out Six Minutes in. And like, she did good. She she was she well, she knows I love this movie, so she's like, I'm gonna try. I'm gonna try. And then you just see the phone slowly creep up, and it's like, I lost her. Shoot, that didn't take very long. Uh yeah, she found it insufferably boring, and I was like, What are you talking about? So many things are happening. Yeah, I don't know. I don't maybe it's nostalgia. I don't know. I loved it. I loved it even today. Haven't seen it in 20 years, still loved it.

SPEAKER_02 3:00

But you have to concede it's it's doesn't work as a movie.

SPEAKER_03 3:08

Um, I do not concede that. With all the tears that I shed at the end of this movie, what I will concede is that they're all fraudulent liars. I will agree on that. Who's a fraudulent liar? The person that wrote the book and then the people that made this movie.

SPEAKER_02 3:27

Um supposedly they're fraudulent liars. Now wait, have you have you read the book?

SPEAKER_03 3:32

Let me look this up. No, I have not read the book. I would like there's five of them now, I think. I think they're up to five.

SPEAKER_02 3:38

Yeah, it's at least three, three or four, maybe five, yeah. Um, I read the synopsis of the book. It seemed almost exactly what the movie was.

SPEAKER_03 3:48

Yeah, yeah. So yes. But I I'm looking this up so I don't mess this up.

The Alleged Ripoff Lawsuit

SPEAKER_03 3:55

There is an Argentinian movie from 1986 called Man Facing Southeast, and they got sued by them because it's apparently just like a word-for-word ripoff from my understanding. Uh, I have not seen that, but a lot like Universal got in trouble. I think it was Universal who released the movie. They got sued, which is a weird person to sue because they wrote they did the movie based word for word on the book. They have the money. They have the money. They have the money. Oh, that's why you sue. No, you're right. You're right. I guess that does make sense. The guy that wrote the book probably don't have a lot of money. You go to the big people. Okay.

SPEAKER_00 4:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 4:36

Um, I don't know what had did they win that? Do you know he ran out of money and so he couldn't continue with the suit. And that's why you sue the person with less money, Dan. That's so you get it, you get a chance of success. You but you win. That's right. And then you can be like, see, I won that one. Uh, but instead you get jerked around by these people with endless pockets, and you lose. And that's a bummer.

SPEAKER_02 4:59

Yeah, I read the plot of the movie. Yeah, it sounded pretty similar, but Okay. I'm of the belief, you know, because I've I've seen things in my existence where two things that are exactly the same happen, and you know that they aren't, you know, it's like it's it's generally not worth your time and energy to rip off something, you know? That's the thing.

SPEAKER_03 5:21

Even if you were Especially like how good was the move that movie? Did it do like super well? I I mean, I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 5:27

It's one of the I think they said it was one of the top 200 movies in Argentinian history.

SPEAKER_03 5:32

And I I don't want to be rude. I don't know much about Argentinian history, but like how big is that? Top 200 doesn't even sound like that good in general.

SPEAKER_02 5:43

I think that's I think it was top 200. I could be wrong, but you know, it was top some some amount.

SPEAKER_03 5:48

Sure.

SPEAKER_02 5:49

So yeah, no, I I kind of agree. You know, it's like if you're lifting some stuff from something like that, well, okay, you know, well, I mean, if you change it enough, I don't know.

SPEAKER_03 6:00

Yeah, who knows? I don't I don't

Why The Movie Feels Broken

SPEAKER_03 6:02

know either. Um but let's talk about why you don't think this perfect movie works as a movie. Let's hear about it, Dan.

SPEAKER_02 6:08

Um because they don't set up any tension. There's no tension in the movie. That's true. They're just like things happen, things happen. Um the things don't ever make any sense. The the S there's weird escalations that don't make any sense. There's I didn't see any of those. His power that powers don't make any sense. Why he's here doesn't make any sense. Why you would want to go to KPEx doesn't make any sense.

SPEAKER_03 6:40

So to be clear, yeah. Are you on the fence? Are you on the side of you think he's from K-Pax?

SPEAKER_02 6:47

Um that's another point. So so basically the premise of the movie is this this guy says he's an alien from a planet capex, his name is Prot, which is the literally the dumbest name ever.

SPEAKER_03 7:00

And that's dumb. I that is the one thing I'll concede to you so far. Because it's very dumb.

SPEAKER_02 7:08

If you were gonna stick up by Prot, then I was like, okay, there's something wrong with his brain. Um, I mean, okay, well, it me see now this is not gonna make me angry that you like this movie because I just this movie on execution seemed weak and seemed like the choices were just super arbitrary. Everything felt very arbitrary in this movie. That that the pieces, the put pieces of the puzzle just didn't fit together into anything. Okay, so he's an alien, yeah, he gets put in an institution, and then he deals with a doctor. The doctor, at a certain point for no known reason, is convinced not even convinced, he's like, Well, maybe this guy's maybe this is maybe this is a delusion. He doesn't start from the point of this is a delusion and the delusion has to be solved. He starts, well, you know, halfway through the movie, maybe this is a delusion and he's actually a normal person.

SPEAKER_03 8:05

No, no, no, no, no. So that's he starts there and then is he wants to believe so badly that it's true.

SPEAKER_02 8:18

No, if if the point was that he doesn't believe that this guy is an alien, point minute one should be trying to figure out who the fuck he is. And and he does not start thinking about who he is until like past the halfway mark of the movie.

SPEAKER_03 8:34

And I don't I don't know anything about that, like that sort of what do you call that? I don't know, like in the psychiatric ward, is that their job to figure out who he is? Wouldn't that be the cops' jobs and his job is just to treat him? I don't know, I don't really know, but I do know he never involved the police, which I found interesting because you would think that this is a mystery missing persons at b at best, right? I I don't know. So that part's weird. I don't feel like it's his job to figure out who he is, though. So I don't I don't fault that part of it. I do feel like there would have to be, even if it's not talked about in the movie, some sort of investigation happening outside of their place. Well, well yeah, he's there for a very long time and nobody seems to care who is.

SPEAKER_02 9:27

Nobody's yeah, there's there's the the the aspects of it of how this movie approaches mental health is the thing pr it's the thing that makes me angry of I think that's okay. How stupidly they they deal with the mental health issue. For sure. Yeah. Um and so the idea is they put it they put him in the hospital and then they start treating him, which is which is just really some very light psychotherapy, I guess, and then attempting to medicate him and but medication doesn't affect him. Um Correct. And then we find out by the it and so he he's an alien from this planet called K-Pax. We find out by the end that the body that he's inhabiting is somebody who went through a trauma and committed suicide. So he's sort of in a catatonic body and then moving them around. Um and then he goes back to K Pax, the planet that he's from at the end. Um Yeah, so as soon as he does and he's very good at astronom astronomy, he does this sort of he meets a bunch of astronomers and then he impresses them with his knowledge. That's the point at which you go, Well, of course then he's an alien. It's it's not uh sure. I I did not spend one second of the movie, even if I knew that at the end they were gonna tell me he was an alien. I don't think they ever set up the concept that anyone in their right mind would think that unless they are just being stubborn. A stubborn person is gonna be like, Well, you're not an alien because that can't be a thing, right? If you're if you're that kind of person, but that kind of person is never gonna be convinced ever. Okay, because their world is is locked down. You know, like if you came up to me and you're like, I'm an alien, and then you presented me with some information that makes me think you're an alien, I'm going to then continue to challenge your alienness every minute of my life until I'm completely convinced or I I I break down your bullshit. But but in this thing, they do one thing that convinces you he's an alien, and then they're like, Well, now you've been convinced, you know, the movie sort of sets it up. It's they're like, it sort of basically tells me, well, now I've convinced you that I'm an alien because no one is ever going to truly question that you're an alien.

SPEAKER_03 11:47

That's interesting because I feel like the Jeff Bridges character constantly is questioning. Yeah. He never does. Even he I that's so interesting. He doesn't attack. I don't know if that's what you're looking for. Yeah. But he he never believes that he's an alien.

SPEAKER_02 12:04

Well, that's just because he doesn't believe in aliens. It's not because he wants to.

SPEAKER_03 12:09

That's the tension. That's one of the two tensions in the movie is this Jeff Bridges, the clinical character, starts in a position where he's like, Well, this guy's not an alien. We just gotta figure out what happened to him and figure, diagnose him. But then throughout the movie, he he wants to believe and never believes. He never fully, he's never able to fully commit to it, and then he finds what he's looking for when he finds his family and the history, and he has that, he has a beautiful line with his wife where he's like, I found what I was looking for, I wish I hadn't. And that's my favorite moment of the movie, is where he's like, I kept looking, I kept looking, and I found the proof that I was looking for, and it broke me. And I was like, Yep. Sometimes you just gotta believe, guys. You just gotta believe. But that's obviously not his job. He would be a pretty bad psychologist. Therapist. Okay, thank you.

SPEAKER_02 13:08

Um see I it's interesting because I think you're I think you're reading over this movie. I think you are bringing all the Tony into it and and making it this this first.

SPEAKER_03 13:25

First of all, you always bring yourself to art. That's the beauty of art. No, you know Dan, you know, I don't know if you have a self. Maybe that's the problem. Dan's a void. Dan is an empty void with an empty vessel.

SPEAKER_02 13:39

Suck it all in and and destroy it. Um because I see, I now I'm beginning to see the movie You Saw, which is an which is an interesting movie, which is he is a person wrestling. I never see him, he never sees me wrestling to me. He's like, you know, I'm I'm sort of listening to the tape, and I, you know, it seems like he's he's fully.

SPEAKER_03 14:05

You don't remember that? His wife's so mad at him for waking up in the middle of the night.

SPEAKER_02 14:10

I mean, he seems more like a guy that's just sort of obsessed with his job. He doesn't this this does not seem like a new thing to him. This just seems like another in the the the you know, he I get that. I feel like I mean if I was writing this movie, he would come in as this dude that's like, I'm not I'm not helping, I'm not, you know, I'm just here, I'm just pushing the I'm just pushing pills out to everybody, which is what that job really is. It's just pushing out the pills, and here he gets a subject that the pills don't do anything. And then he he reacts to that in like a way like, well, wait a second, you know, maybe I gotta go back to first principles and and really try to psychoanalyze this guy, and then we get this the psycho. I mean, the and that's the whole thing is you know, uh him going and seeing the astronomers and doing that, just it seems like a waste. It seems like you're just you're moving away from the good stuff, which is which is what this guy has constructed.

SPEAKER_03 15:14

That's so I and I but listen, I don't again, I don't know anything about the psycho arts. I'm making up some words, psycho arts.

SPEAKER_02 15:22

Yeah, you just say psychoanalysis or psychiatric.

SPEAKER_03 15:25

Sure, yeah, yeah, that sort of thing. But in my what I'm seeing is he's trying to prove to Prot the truth. He's trying to make him see, so instead of being like, I know the truth, he wants him to know the truth, and he has to find it on his own. So he's like, I'm gonna bring you into this room full of people that know shit, and they're gonna show you that you don't know shit. And then what really happens is Prote's like, Well, I know more than them, which is impossible. And he's and then he has that line on the when he's when they're all heading out and he's with his friend, he's like, What just happened in there? And his friend is like, I don't know what I believe, but that was basically impossible. And so the doctor has to wrestle, he's like, I I don't know how to explain what he's doing, but I also know that he's not this thing. So I you know, it's I don't know, it's very interesting to me.

SPEAKER_02 16:19

See, I I once again, I see that you you were seeing these connections that are sort of there, but but then Jeff Bridge just doesn't really, he doesn't really, you know, and in that matter, the astronomers then just disappear.

SPEAKER_03 16:35

And well that part's true, damn.

SPEAKER_02 16:38

In in any yeah, literally. Uh and literally, um that's the part when every you know, any Spielberg movie, it's like then the government gets involved. Because here we have a guy who is who has who has given off knowledge that he shouldn't be able to give off. And so 100% that leads to other people involved. And then, you know, these guys just they just walk back to their you know their space station and just are like, eh, whatever. Yeah, okay. He he got, you know, he did this thing.

SPEAKER_03 17:11

Their lives didn't seem to change, even though this guy was just like, here's an equation that you won't know for 50 to 100 years, uh, enjoy. And they're like, oh wow, cool.

SPEAKER_02 17:20

And that's you know the question of an alien walking around and proving his alienness to a bunch of very smart people who I don't know if astronomers are powerful, they're not, but they might be like don't add us astronomers, okay? They might you know have some connection to some government spooks that are gonna be like wait, we wish. Right? I don't know. That's a that's a third act. The the third act of this movie is he goes and and this guy just reenacts a crime for him, and he's all like, Oh, well, you could have just shown me a picture in the first 30 seconds of me being there, and I'd have been like, Oh, that's our guy, right?

SPEAKER_03 17:56

But you gotta you gotta live, you live it, you feel it. It's horrible. Oh, I cry. I cry, I cry.

SPEAKER_02 18:03

Did you now were you emotionally invested in that rape and and double murder?

SPEAKER_03 18:08

Oh, yeah. No, it's brutal. Were you? Yeah, a hundred. I'm telling you, I cried. I cried every time. Listen, so again, to reiterate to everyone, I haven't seen this movie probably 20 years. Yeah, 20 years ago, I used to have this argument with a bunch of people because I always love this movie. And everyone's like, what are you talking about? And I'm like, it's there, guys. It's there. I promise it's there. You gotta look for it. It's there. Um, yeah, no, it's terrible. Because then, you know, you you put yourself in his shoes, and it's like, what would what would you do? I would do the same thing, you know? I'm gonna murder that guy, guaranteed, or die trying. Luckily, he was very strong, which I found interesting because Kevin Spacey's twerping. Right, yeah. I think they say something on the lines of like strong as an ox or you know, something like ridiculous like that. I'm like, guys, you know, you cast Kevin Spacey, right? Like, I don't believe that for a second. Yeah, have him pick up a shovel and wipe the guy in the head, you know, right, but breaks his neck with his bare hands. They said snapped his neck like a twig or something. I was like, no, he can't do that. Uh so you gotta spend some belief there. See, you um see that's the thing.

SPEAKER_02 19:24

You could you have a constructed movie that you you're watching, which is fine. It's it's there it's called K-Pax, and it's beautiful. There are the there are the bones of that movie you're talking about, but that movie's not here on the screen.

SPEAKER_03 19:40

Sure. Now, let me let me pitch something to you because I you know I get it. You you cast Kevin Space because he's wonderful in this movie. Don't like this man as a person. He's wonderful in this movie. I hated him. Oh, really? I'm gonna strongly disagree with you on that. I think he's wonderful. He was the most painful part of this old movie. But imagine if you had someone who is big, you know, 6'2, 6'3, a hulking guy. And when then that first scene makes more sense when not first scene, but the first time they meet, and everyone's kind of like, don't worry, he's gentle. The green heart is just a hulking. Thank you. Yeah, get a Michael Clark Duncan, right? Exactly. Different movies. I I think totally totally different movie, yeah. Uh, but I think that's what they think they're telling you somehow, and that it doesn't make a lot of sense. I will tell you, they shoot a lot in that flashback. All of the angles are up to make him look bigger, which is funny to me because the rest of the movie you don't do that, and it's like, did he shrink? Is that are you trying to tell me he used to be bigger than he is now? Like, I don't understand what we're doing. He withered away. It's been five years, he lost six six inches and 200 pounds. So wait, um, very strange. Yeah, do you believe he's an alien? I still don't know. I go back and forth all the time. Because I personally, I love, and I I don't this is dark, I guess, but I love the movie in which he's not an alien. The movie in which this guy's coping mechanism every time something dramatic happens, he you know, switches and he's this other thing, and now he has he has learned to love again. Um that that scene where he's like, I get the feeling I'm going to be missed, and that's what he needed to feel again, and now he's ready to let go. Oh, okay. So that's that's a movie that I love.

SPEAKER_02 21:44

So now now that he feels again, he can go back to being catatonic.

SPEAKER_03 21:48

He he's done. Like he so like that's what he's missing, right? And that's what broke him, and he became this other his other personality again, and which is just this guy from a Different planet that has no connections. He's got they don't believe in family on K-Pax. He's got nothing. And he goes to this place that everyone falls in love with him and he learns to love again. And that's enough for him to be like, I I am I'm human again, and his human form is destroyed. But he's able to let go of this fictitious guy that is unattached to everything.

SPEAKER_02 22:22

God, I wish I wish that was this movie.

SPEAKER_03 22:27

Well, Dan, it's there. You gotta look for it, but it's there.

SPEAKER_02 22:31

No, I mean, I you know, I see how you could translate this movie into that sentiment. It's like I got I got so little of that. Because they didn't, they didn't they never play the movie never played the game. It's more like a it it is more like a book where this person has just made these decisions. Sure. And it's you know, it's like you here you go. I'm gonna ask you the question. Well, I guess you can't answer this question. What are what are his powers? But you don't you don't know if he has powers.

SPEAKER_03 23:06

Yeah, I don't know if I believe he has powers. Yeah. Okay, well, let's let's start from the beginning then. Here's what I will say, just real quickly. Yeah. Um, I again I never read the book. I am interested to read the book, but it's very hard to find now. And so I really, you know, I don't give a shit. Um, but from from the things that I've read, just doing a little bit of research, is the movie supposedly takes the approach of he's an alien, but maybe he's crazy. And the book is more like this guy's crazy, but maybe he's an alien. There's like a dichotomy of of how they approach it. And so I'd be interested to read the book just to see if that lens is more aligned to what I like.

SPEAKER_02 23:56

I mean, if you were trying to write this, you would try to write it so that things can swing either way, right? For sure. Yeah, for sure. So that everything that seems like a miracle has has things that sort of make it not seem like a miracle.

unknown 24:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 24:11

You know, and be like, oh, oh, he. Well, I guess he could have he could have seen these these this this you know uh orbital pattern in Scientific American that came out five years ago, you know, something like that. And then they're like, well, you know, you have to build that doubt in my mind because if he he they built it in your mind, but they didn't build it for one second in my mind.

SPEAKER_03 24:36

No, I get the movie, the movie very much plays at these things are impossible.

SPEAKER_00 24:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 24:43

Straight up. Like I I agree with that 100%. Uh and then like seeing the ultraviolet light, even on even in doing research on that, I didn't do the research, other people have done the research. Is there is some things that can allow humans to see spectrums of ultraviolet light, but the actual spectrum that they note is impossible. So there's like, yes, humans can see ultraviolet in some very specific cases, but never at this level. So there's yeah, it's very clear that they're leaning towards, yeah, this guy's name. I mean, the woman disappears.

SPEAKER_00 25:18

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 25:19

So, you know, you

Plot Setup At Grand Central

SPEAKER_03 25:21

get it.

SPEAKER_02 25:21

So we start off in, I think, Grand Central Station. Uh, here's a guy in a wheelchair panhandler. Well, one of the guys that I think he played Clark in the wire. Um wow. Here he sees KPEx standing there, looking like he just arrived. I guess he does just arrive, doesn't he? He does he light beams around.

SPEAKER_03 25:41

Appears in the beam of light. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 25:43

Yeah. So there he is. And then this woman gets her purse snatched, and then the guy takes off, and then K-PEx or Groat Proat helps her. Groat. I like Groat. That's what I I I the proat name just has not. It's terrible. It doesn't stick in my brain at all. It's just terrible. Um, so he goes to help, and then the cops come over and they're like, Oh, you attacked this woman. They asked the woman, she says, No, he didn't attack me. They asked the guy in the wheelchair, he didn't attack him. Then they take him in because they attacked the woman.

SPEAKER_03 26:19

No, they take him in because he's crazy. Because he says something about how he's not from here. He just arrived, and they're like, Where's your ticket? He's like, I didn't have a ticket. And they're like, This something's wrong with this guy. We're bringing him in.

SPEAKER_02 26:31

Okay, first of all, they wouldn't go any, they wouldn't touch this guy. There's no predicated crime. There's no reason to put him in an institution. He didn't have a ticket, Dan. All right. No ticket, no entry. The thing about the mental health system is, especially in New York, they don't want to. You gotta prove your point if they're gonna take it. We do not have a bed for this guy that is not violent and hasn't literally hasn't done anything other than not carry ID. They couldn't ask him for ID. It's not legal for them to ask him for ID. And so he does not have to present ID. He does not have to ID him to self to them if there is no predicated crime. There is no predicated crime, they would have taken him to booking and they would have sent him right back on his way. Sure.

unknown 27:19

Sure.

SPEAKER_02 27:19

But the pr Okay. Hmm, you don't think he's you're not sure if he's an alien. So I go back and forth. I believe at some point he says, I'm leaving I can only go on a light beam back home when nobody else is coming, right?

SPEAKER_03 27:40

Yeah, like when no no one else is traveling, because you can't cross streams. Yeah. That's a Ghostbusters reference.

SPEAKER_02 27:47

Did you take the implication of that that he is saying there are more capaxians on Earth and there are quite a few capaxians on Earth? Not just Earth, but yeah, they're everywhere.

SPEAKER_03 27:56

They're they're travelers.

SPEAKER_02 27:57

We're just talking about Earth. Are there other Capaxians on Earth?

SPEAKER_03 28:01

Yes, there are. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 28:05

Why does he why does he admit to every anyone and every that he's a Capaxian?

SPEAKER_03 28:13

Because it doesn't matter to him. I don't know. What do you mean? To him, it's not a big deal. You know, like what what do you mean? What's your question?

SPEAKER_02 28:24

Well, does that mean every Capaxian you're gonna meet's gonna be like, yeah, I'm from Capax? If that's gonna be probably not. So he's a special capaxian who's the only one. So the other capaxians are just there to, you know, go to the spa or something because they like spa days. Just to travel. Yeah, just to travel. He's the only one that needs so he admits that anyone and everyone, I'm from Capax, and I'm a this, and here's all this specialized information that I have that no one else has.

SPEAKER_03 28:54

Think about this. What if he's a stupid capaxian?

SPEAKER_02 28:58

Well, that's to be expected. Um it just seems like he just it's it's I mean, that goes more towards he's mentally ill that he's saying all this stuff for attention.

SPEAKER_03 29:16

Not necessarily. I would argue not attention, but deflection. You know, it's part of it is to convince himself that he's from K Pax, you know?

SPEAKER_02 29:26

I guess my my whole point is I wish they had set up the dichotomy better so that you I get that. I get that.

SPEAKER_03 29:33

Yeah, I totally I totally understand that.

SPEAKER_00 29:36

You know, and the way he the way he acts, the way Kevin Spacey acts. I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 29:52

I just it uh it annoys me. No, it's not inhuman.

SPEAKER_03 29:57

Maybe you're racist. That's not right. Species, species, species. Species. Speciist. I blew that up.

SPEAKER_02 30:06

He just is so he's so like cloying, you know, just like oh that that's just it's just like what well Dan, you've never been to K Pax.

SPEAKER_03 30:18

All right. Um that's just how they are there, you know?

SPEAKER_02 30:24

He's just so annoying. Um, okay.

Inside The Ward And Its Weird Logic

SPEAKER_02 30:28

So here we get to meet, we get to meet the doctor. He's Mark Powell. We're just gonna call him Doc. Um Doc. Or the Doctor. He's at the Psychiatric Institute of Manhattan. They they put KPAX, uh, I might just call him K Pax. They put Pro into Bellevue, and then they bumped him out of Bellevue to Manhattan. So here he comes. Um the doc is already dealing with Ernie, who's agoraphobic, who hates germs. So we have Ernie who hates germs. We have Howie, who we don't ever get a diagnosis on. We get the lady, Miss Doris Archer, who is delusional about being a rich person or something. Yeah, something like that. Who can't come out of her room. Then we got the sweaty guy who is afraid of the stink.

SPEAKER_03 31:24

I'm gonna here's you weren't paying enough attention, Dan, because everyone is sweaty. And I think the one thing we need to ask about this movie is why does this facility not have air conditioning? This feels uninhabitable. I think they're trying to kill all these patients. Everyone is so sweaty when they're in the room. It's weird. That's it. That's the number one thing that bothers me about this movie. Every time you're in the ward, I'll call it the ward. Ward, good. Uh, they're just, everyone's just caked in sweat. Now, is that a filming thing? Like, are the is it real? Are they all sweaty because they have to turn out the AC because of the sound? They're like, we gotta cut the AC, guys, it's too loud, and then everyone just dies. I don't know, but everyone's caked in sweat on that set.

SPEAKER_02 32:11

I I don't believe the Psychiatric Institute of Manhattan would, I believe it would have AC. So they're I believe it would too. So the first thing, so I guess he spent a month in Bellevue. And then Which one is Howie? Is he the one with glasses? Howie is the one waiting for the bluebird.

SPEAKER_03 32:30

Okay, so he's obsessive compulsive. Oh, yeah, he's obsessive compulsive.

SPEAKER_02 32:35

Yeah, he is obsessive compulsive.

SPEAKER_03 32:37

He's great, by the way. I like him a lot.

SPEAKER_02 32:39

The actor's good. I think he's one of the better actors in the movie. Yeah. Um, so we find out that that Prot is immune to thorazine and all these other drugs. Okay, so no. You know, you're not no one is immune to thorazine.

SPEAKER_03 32:58

No one is immune to I'm pretty sure I could build up an immunity. So what happened is he just kept shooting up over and over until he developed an immunity. Is that I don't know how thorazine works, but I feel pretty confident.

SPEAKER_02 33:10

Um, so he the doc's gonna have his first thing in there. He comes in. Does he eat an apple hole first? Does he eat the banana hole first?

SPEAKER_03 33:19

He eats the apple hole first. Okay, and then the banana comes later. And you know.

SPEAKER_02 33:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 33:24

So to show the wonderful line about your produce alone has been worth the trip. Great stuff. I love this movie. But also, I mean, he's really doing it, by the way. Like, there's no way to fake that. He's eating these, I and it's disgusting to me.

SPEAKER_02 33:40

You can eat a banana like that, and you can eat the corners.

SPEAKER_03 33:42

People have told me that. I don't believe you.

SPEAKER_02 33:45

I heard somebody talking about it the other day. You can't eat the you can't eat the whole banana.

SPEAKER_03 33:49

The other day?

SPEAKER_02 33:50

Yeah, literally. Literally this this week, I was there was something podcast or something, and they talked about eating a whole banana. Which is really weird. I I don't know. It might be hard to get through the little the little stem on the end, though. Yeah, yeah, no, thanks.

SPEAKER_03 34:06

But he he puts that in his mouth.

SPEAKER_02 34:08

And you could definitely eat an apple all the way through. It's not gonna be pleasant.

SPEAKER_03 34:12

I've heard that, but also I heard that it would grow in your stomach, I think. That and pumpkin seeds. So that that's what children say. Yeah, so I don't I don't believe you. Well, I did not say, well, you don't believe me, what?

unknown 34:26

Maybe.

SPEAKER_03 34:27

Then I can eat an apple cord, Dan. Why don't you do it on air and survive? You could do it, and you can't do it.

SPEAKER_02 34:34

Well, no, you can do it. Should you do it? It's a separate issue, Tony.

unknown 34:39

Wow.

SPEAKER_03 34:40

Ooh, Capex and Apple Tree growing out of your nostrils.

SPEAKER_02 34:44

That's that's called troll two. Um great movie. So he eats the whole apple, and then we get a whole you think I'm crazy, where is home? Capex, it's a planet uh a thousand light years away in the Lyra system. Travels by light. Um why do you look human? And then he does this sort of soap bubble illusion where you're like, Well, that doesn't make any sense. Basically, if I come to your house and your your house is full of human beings, then I look like a human being.

SPEAKER_03 35:19

Or seem like a human being. That's what he that's what he says. But now, and so here's here's the counter pitch to him being truly an alien, right? Yeah. Is that that's just not true. He's inhabiting the body of a human. So he was lying? I don't know. That's what I'm saying. For a movie that seems to lean towards him being an alien, that doesn't make a lot of sense.

SPEAKER_02 35:42

See, what I would have said was if I was writing this stupid story, then he says, Oh, I just take over a body that's not in use. Right. And that's and that makes perfect sense. That sets up the central mystery.

SPEAKER_03 35:55

Well, who is this guy? 100%. Yeah. But that's not what they do.

SPEAKER_02 36:00

That is not what they do.

SPEAKER_03 36:01

And so again, the question is, where does Bess go? You know? She goes to Cape. Why is her body traveling? She goes to Cape. His body doesn't travel, his his consciousness travels on light. Her body can travel on light? Very confusing. Sure, why not? I mean, technically, I guess they say that his body, he also uses that body to travel on light because he goes up north. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 36:23

So he could travel that body around on light. The rules are pretty loosey-goosey there. Well, yeah, they're the rules are terrible. That's why this movie's terrible. That's why he's a human. He's not an alien. Um, so then you know, he's here on Earth just because he wants to watch it, and you guys are in BA3 early evolution, you know. So he's like, he likes to see planets that are at this point, you know, where we all rudimentary. We are doing war and things. Okay.

SPEAKER_03 36:57

Yeah. A bunch of dum dumps.

SPEAKER_02 36:59

Um, he's now he's integrated into the the group, and they start asking him questions about telescopes, Capex, and the seven moons, two sons.

SPEAKER_03 37:08

Um too many sons. I don't even like having one son. Gotta have two. Because of the cancer. Oh, the cancer.

SPEAKER_02 37:15

Yeah, cancer is a problem. He goes home to his wife and daughter. This is his second wife, and then second, you know, and first child with the new wife. He's got an old wife that he has a son with. Then we sort of no, we meet him at the end.

SPEAKER_03 37:32

No, no, no, the wife. We never meet his first wife.

SPEAKER_02 37:34

Oh, we never meet the first wife, no.

SPEAKER_03 37:36

Yeah. Which is fine. I just saying.

SPEAKER_02 37:38

And we immediately realize he's an absent husband. Why is he an absent husband, Tony?

SPEAKER_03 37:43

Because all doctors are they're so self-absorbed, you know.

SPEAKER_02 37:49

Well, good. Glad we learned this important thing about all doctors and nothing about him.

SPEAKER_03 37:55

There you go. Perfect. Um Yeah, he just, you know, he's just into his job, I guess. But shouldn't shouldn't that change? I don't know, it doesn't really matter.

SPEAKER_02 38:06

Um, so he says he says it took him seven years to travel here.

SPEAKER_03 38:12

As opposed to, you know, whatever it was supposed to because of the light travel. They're traveling at the multiple of C.

SPEAKER_02 38:20

So I think four or five C is how they travel.

SPEAKER_03 38:22

I don't know what C means. So I that's speed of light. C is speed of light? Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 38:28

Okay. What do you mean? You don't understand what the speed of light is?

SPEAKER_03 38:32

Uh no, I don't understand it, Dan.

SPEAKER_02 38:36

Well, like uh say a piece of light leaves the sun, comes here, sure. Sure. Uh what is it? Travels at 186,000 hours. I don't know. How did we measure that?

SPEAKER_03 38:48

I don't understand science.

SPEAKER_02 38:50

I don't know. I don't know. I think the speed lies also 186,000 miles per hour sandwiches. That's a lot. Something like that. It's very fast.

SPEAKER_00 39:03

I don't think so.

SPEAKER_02 39:04

Um this he does another session. This is when he eats a banana. And then he's like, tell me about your childhood. And then we do this whole unpleasant reproduction where like uh their sex is terrible, it's painful, they don't like it, but they still do it. The kids are raised communally.

SPEAKER_03 39:26

So, first of all, that's a metaphor, right? No, I don't know. Because reproducing leads to pain, leads to loss. His kid is dead. No, I think the implication is that like they're pointy dicks or something. No, no. I know what he's saying. It's a metaphor or an analogy, which I don't know. It's an analogy. Simile. I don't know anything. It's not a simile.

SPEAKER_02 39:53

Actually, I think it's an analogy because it's an analogous. Analogous. Basically, he's saying that on KPEC sex is painful. Uh, and the implication is that his who the true character that he is thinks that you don't want to have sex because you don't want to perform.

SPEAKER_03 40:12

Finds it.

SPEAKER_02 40:12

You see, once again, if that was the whole thing, if he was like came there and was a weirdo and couldn't make connections with people, and then it was about him making connections and learning to reconnect with the world, then I'd be like, oh, okay, now I get it. But it but that's not who he is. He's like just just weird smarty mouth that just is like doing all these weird things.

SPEAKER_03 40:34

Sure, I understand what you're saying, but he's created this unaffected being. Okay. And that's what he's doing. And then you have to break down the walls of that being and remind him what it is to have community, to have family, to have love, you know. But he's had five years to do that. But it hasn't been going very good. I mean, humans are terrible. Okay, wait, let's just let's be very clear.

SPEAKER_02 41:03

This is the first place where it's coming together. Okay. Uh he's got like this little secret book that he writes little secret notes in, which he leaves behind, and the doc gets. Once again, the government would want that. They'd want to have the code people go over that.

SPEAKER_03 41:18

So, you know. But I would pocket it. So I get it. I would be just like the doc and be like, no, this is mine. This is my book now.

SPEAKER_02 41:26

So Proats, you know, cruising around. He sees Bess cruising around who's having a hard time. Uh the one guy says that she lit her house on fire. The other guy says, no, there was an electrical fire. Um they throw jello at Dolores. No, Dolores throws jello.

SPEAKER_03 41:46

She throws the cello, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 41:48

Um then Miss Miss Doris. That's oh, is that Doris? Was that Doris that threw it? I guess it was Doris.

unknown 41:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 41:55

Doris Archer, she has a bell to ring for when people want. And she's putting on rouge, waiting for a male collar or something.

SPEAKER_03 42:04

Yeah, a male collar. That's what she says. I don't I don't know what her deal is.

SPEAKER_02 42:08

I'm expecting someone. How long are you expecting someone? For 11 years. I see. I really, this this whole movie made me feel like someone needs to remake this as a comedy.

SPEAKER_03 42:24

I'm first of all, I'm your guy. I'm in. Let's do this. Give me a pitch.

SPEAKER_02 42:30

Just, you know, all these stupid characters, you know, being weird. Sure. And, you know, here comes Tony playing K-Pax. Oh, wow, I'm casting the movie? You've you've won me over. Well, you've got to play K-Pax, because I mean, you can't be any worse than what's his name? See if it's Basie. Not as a human, that's for sure.

SPEAKER_03 42:52

Got him.

SPEAKER_02 42:55

Uh, we're back in session. The doctor turns off the lights, and then he's like, tell me more about your families. We don't have families. Haven't you been listening? There's no marriage, there's no wives, there's no families, there's no government, there's no laws. He's like, What if someone killed someone?

SPEAKER_03 43:14

There's no government, no laws, because nobody breaks laws. And he gives the speech about the eye for the eye. Remember that? What was that? It's stupid. Eye for an eye is stupid. Right, but that's what he did.

SPEAKER_02 43:28

Tony.

SPEAKER_03 43:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 43:30

This is is this about all the information that we get about life on KPEX?

SPEAKER_03 43:35

Um, no, there's a couple other things. You know, they've got great uh truffles. I got some good food there. Some good flowers that smell good, apparently. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 43:47

Uh yeah.

SPEAKER_03 43:50

Why would you want to go there? Because it's not here. It's anywhere but here, man.

SPEAKER_02 43:56

But like everybody's in a place. Everybody's in a motionless dick there.

SPEAKER_03 44:01

Yeah, exactly. That's where you want to go? You can do whatever you want, baby. What is that? I wouldn't want to go there because let's be very real with each other, Dan. I would be attracted to aliens. It's just one of my things. And so I wouldn't be able to do that. I'd be like, well, there's no point in going to that planet. Can't fall in love.

SPEAKER_02 44:22

But maybe, well, maybe you could be, maybe it wouldn't be painful to you be planting seed all over the place.

SPEAKER_03 44:28

I don't think I'll I'll give it a shot. You let me know, I'm going. You talked me into it. I just, I'm not sure why everybody wants to go to KPAX. Because it's, you know, it's peace. Everyone's at peace. There's no conflict. Are they? There's no peace? Yeah, yeah. So there's no conflict because there's also no connection. And I know that may that might sound weird, but that's the whole thing, is it's just peace. You know where we get in trouble when we care about shit.

SPEAKER_02 44:55

So you you want to go to a place where you don't care about anything and there's nothing going on.

SPEAKER_03 45:01

Exactly. It's just peace. It's just beauty all over the place. Peaceful. Quiet. Smells good. So that's heaven, except with painful sex. Also heaven. I think God was anti-sex. I don't remember. I don't I haven't read my book in a while.

SPEAKER_02 45:19

I just, you know, if you explain KPAX to me, I was just like, I mean, I'd like to go there for a couple of days, but I wouldn't want to live there.

SPEAKER_03 45:29

For sure. This is like um, you know, a weekend. This is like a Vegas for me. You know what I mean? Like I'll go for two days, maybe three, any longer than that. I'm out. I'm over this shit. Uh, I agree. But, you know, as uh Bessie says in her note, which is beautiful, I have no home. What a lovely thing. Oh, God, makes me cry every time. Um, the guy that smells everything smells bad, it's gonna smell good for him. If he goes to a place that smells good everywhere, then he's gonna be happy. That's his only problem. I don't know what his real problem is, but you know, in his mind, that's his problem. So I get why these people specifically would want to go. He's in the right place, the right community for people all to want to go with him.

SPEAKER_02 46:16

Okay, now we have the family barbecue. His sister brings up that uh the doc has a has a son that he never talks to. We don't explain why he doesn't ever talk to the son. They just he's independent.

SPEAKER_03 46:28

It's Aaron Paul. He's clearly a little bitch.

SPEAKER_02 46:31

Was it Aaron Paul?

SPEAKER_03 46:32

I thought it might be. Yeah, yeah, that's Aaron Paul. Yeah. Oh, okay. Aaron Paul with a what, an eyebrow ring or something crazy. Man.

SPEAKER_02 46:40

Then we also said that her his sister's husband is the astronomer person who we're gonna astronomize with. Astronomize. Boom, we go back to the the ward. Here's how he's staring out the window, and he is looking for the blue bird of happiness, which Pro has set him to three tasks. The first is to stare out the window till he sees the blue bird of happiness. And then as soon as those three things happen, he will be cured.

SPEAKER_03 47:14

Science. Is that a very interesting message in this in the movie, and I assume the book as well, which is like just get over it? Like, and not in a in a necessarily a rude way, but it definitely looks down on the profession.

SPEAKER_02 47:35

You mean the way that they approach mental health treatment?

SPEAKER_03 47:38

Yeah, I'm trying to be very gentle. Yes.

SPEAKER_02 47:40

Oh, you mean basically all you have to do to treat someone with a mental health issue is say, why don't you get over your bullshit and then you can go live life? Yes.

SPEAKER_03 47:50

Correct. Yes, I noticed that in this movie. So that yeah. So that's an that's a thing that I don't like in the movie. In a movie that I really do genuinely like, it's like all every time they bring something up, it's like, that's a weird take to have. Like that's a straight, like whoever, I don't know who wrote that book, but like that's a weird take. Yep. Um, and you should probably not spread that gospel around. Yes. We need help.

SPEAKER_02 48:16

You know, when we get to the second half mental health stuff, you're just like, wait, what happens?

SPEAKER_03 48:20

Oh my god. Okay. Yeah, no, I I do agree. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 48:27

I wrote something about outside working on Ernie, give hit gives him the answers. I don't know what that means.

SPEAKER_03 48:34

I guess I guess Prot is working doing stuff with Ernie, who's the uh the guy that's yeah, and he's basically like there's no toxins, because if there were, I'd be able to see them and I don't see them, and it seems to he's outside now. I don't know. You get it. Mental health. So he's pretty easy to solve.

SPEAKER_02 48:53

Talks to the brother-in-law, he sent the brother-in-law some of the astronomy stuff, and the brother-in-law is like, okay, let's meet him. Okay. Um, so the doc is working at home, his kid's playing piano badly, and so he closes the door. Yeah, so we see the he's continually continuing to be estranged from his children.

SPEAKER_03 49:14

You're like, okay, whatever. Now, if that was new, I agree with you. If that was new, it'd be much more impactful. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 49:21

Yeah.

Planetarium Proof And The Bluebird

SPEAKER_02 49:22

At night, we go on the field trip, and this is when we go to the planetarium. We meet the astronomers, he proves that he has astronomical knowledge that he should not be able to have. We play wondrous music during all this. Whoa! Isn't this amazing? I like the score.

SPEAKER_03 49:38

I like the score. I think it's nice.

SPEAKER_02 49:40

Uh, I think if you scored this differently, it becomes a horror movie.

SPEAKER_03 49:44

Um I can't totally argue that, but yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 49:50

So we're about halfway through the movie, and boom, Howie sees the blue bird. What tap with what happens with Howie sees the blue bird?

SPEAKER_03 49:58

Everybody gets excited. Everyone's coming to the window looking at the bird. It's beautiful. Beautiful moment.

SPEAKER_02 50:06

You don't like this moment? It's this it's this is this moment earned.

SPEAKER_03 50:13

Yeah. Because he spent a lot of time looking out that window.

SPEAKER_02 50:16

And who's cheering for the bird?

SPEAKER_03 50:19

Everybody. Everybody's cheering for the bird. How many floors of people are cheering for the bird? At least four, one of which has a guy that might be naked. He's at the very least topless. Do you see? Did you see him? He's in the if you're watching the screen, he's in the top left window as they pan up. All you see is like waist up, but he's against the glass banging, and he's got a similar body to mine, and he is what I could see fully naked. Um, which again, it's a weird thing to put in there.

SPEAKER_02 50:50

But has this movie earned the entire hospital losing their minds because he looked out the window and saw a bird that was blue? Donated their floor. Five floors. But their floor for sure. But there's five floors. The entire hospital is losing its mind.

SPEAKER_03 51:09

Maybe the bluebird. Maybe they're in some sort of hangout where all the floors come and go, so everyone was aware of it. You don't know how the hospital works. I mean, it should just be their floor, I agree. It's just but then you wouldn't get the naked man in the window, so now I'm back on the other side of it. It's just too much.

SPEAKER_02 51:33

Simply too good. And even Mrs. Archer leaves her room. And that is Mrs. Archer's breakthrough of the movie, which is kind of downplayed, right? She does not get another. That's her entire breakthrough.

unknown 51:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 51:48

And they're sort of like, she never leaves her room. And you're like, wait a second. If you're making a real movie, the the breakthrough should cascade through the movie, right? We need to we need to see each person have their breakthrough.

unknown 52:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 52:03

And then lead to me. Or at least to them having a more positive result in the future. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

unknown 52:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 52:10

That's not we she has her breakthrough now, and it's pretty much forgotten instantaneously.

SPEAKER_03 52:16

Sure. She's not coming though along the K Packs, though, so she's a pretty small character.

SPEAKER_02 52:21

Screw um Bess goes to visit Prot, and she's like, I know who you are. You're the bluebird. Okay. Uh Sweaty Guy wants Prot's attention, and he wants Prot to explain light travel. Because he wants to go. He sets up his whole backstory as he was a doorman, and then he had some sort of psychotic break, and now the world is stinky to him. And he'd like to he'd like to smell KPEx.

SPEAKER_03 52:53

Because he thinks Prot smells good.

SPEAKER_02 52:55

Oh, yeah, there you go. Uh Prot sets up to the doctor that he is leaving, so we've set we've set a clock on for the second half of the movie. I'm leaving on July 27th at 551.

SPEAKER_03 53:08

That he's leaving? What do I care if he's leaving? Because what does that mean? Because again, you're on the the he's an alien thing, but you know, the first time you see this, and if you're not in the fully buying he's an alien, what does that mean? Like that's very troublesome. Why is there a date? What's gonna happen?

SPEAKER_02 53:25

Well, we've not really we've not really set up that he's confined here.

SPEAKER_03 53:30

But he's supposed to be. He gets yelled at every time he leaves.

SPEAKER_02 53:35

I mean, but we've not we've not set that up. If you watch not yet later, you see, I as a kid saw one that flew over a cuckoo's nest, or maybe I didn't, I don't know if I've ever seen that movie, but I you know, you they talked enough about it. You know, I read You feel like you've seen it. Well, I I read the re the Mad Magazine version of it, and you know, you saw enough clips. That's all you need. And it's like, yeah, they they couldn't just walk out. They there's not an option for watching. Sure. And this one, they don't set up their confinement at all.

SPEAKER_03 54:04

And they don't They don't. They expect you to know that, Dan. Because then later when he goes up north, quote unquote, comes back, then he gets yelled at. He's like, You can't just leave. You're a patient here. So, you know, it's there. Yeah, but he didn't even And when he goes to the cookout, he has to have all those people with him because he's not really allowed to leave, but he's on a day pass. You know, you get it. Yeah, but where were all those people when they went to the astronomy the planetarium? Well, that one was in secret, I'm pretty sure. I think that one was against the rules.

SPEAKER_02 54:40

Uh okay.

Fourth Of July And The Sprinkler Trigger

SPEAKER_02 54:43

So now he plans to bring him over to the house on 4th of July. Um to uh to uh I don't know why. Show him what a family is. Oh, so he's trying to teach him what a family is.

SPEAKER_03 54:59

R Yeah, yeah, essentially. But more like, you know what a family is. Here is a family. What are you gonna do when you see it? Is it gonna remind you of what a family is?

SPEAKER_02 55:10

See, what he should be doing, he should be trying to write a book about this guy, right?

SPEAKER_03 55:14

Sure. Because that's your classic thing, right? That's your that's your silence of the lambs. Name the book K-Pax, and then it's one of those full circle moments where it's like, there is a book, K Pax, and then I buy it. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_02 55:26

Um, so he takes him home. Uh, one of the kids says he looks like data, a little bit of Star Trek trivia. Uh the the dog barks at him while looking up at a trainer that we cannot see. Um Correct. Yep. Some of the worst trainer work I've ever seen in a movie. It's hard. Okay, Dan. Sheesh. So K Pex talks to the dog. He's like, Mark, mark, mark, mark, mark. And the dog's like, mark, mark, mark, mark, mark, mark, mark, mark, mark, mark, bar, bar. And then we learn the grievances of the dog, which is something about a shoe.

SPEAKER_03 56:01

Yeah, they keep hiding a shoe and then sneaking up on his left side. Oh, because he's got ear problems. Yeah, yeah, he got ear problems.

SPEAKER_02 56:11

He dishes up way too much fruit salad. Um loves that fruit. He goes in the house and investigates the doc's life, finds out about the sun, uh, sees the wonder of the viewmaster. Um they talk to the family and worry. And then he's like, We don't have families on KPEx. And the wife's like, Yeah, because you're dumb. I'm with the wife. Essentially, yeah, you're missing out. So he goes back outside, and lo and behold, he's pushing the little girl in the swing, and the sprinkler goes off and he freaks out, and they have to turn the sprinkler off. Um, and he's more the okay, and this is why the movie doesn't work. This is this whole scene is the proof why that first of all, you have to injure the little girl at least a little.

unknown 57:07

Right?

SPEAKER_03 57:08

Whoa, Dan. Whoa. Yes, okay.

SPEAKER_02 57:09

You have to actually make him finally dangerous, right? We've been promised danger. He's been the most the least dangerous person on the planet. We need it, we need some danger, right? He needs to like break the girl's legs or break her break her back, maybe.

SPEAKER_03 57:25

You know, maybe she's paralyzed for life. Okay, no, no, no, no. Maybe a neck, you know. Just kill her. Just get her out of the movie. Jesus, dude.

SPEAKER_02 57:34

The doc is more worried about Prote than he is his own daughter.

SPEAKER_03 57:38

Correct.

SPEAKER_02 57:40

I'm like, we need to emphasize that. He needs to be like, Prote, what happened? Why were you triggered by the the swing and the and the sprinkler? He doesn't even sort of do that. He kind of just like you okay, bro? And then he's like, let me go back to being robot camp spacey space alien, and then he then he goes over and sees his daughter. Okay, first of all, you take the violent criminal out of the insane asylum, and then the violent criminal does something violent, and there are no repercussions to this.

SPEAKER_03 58:17

Yeah. Because he's not violent. That's what that's what his whole point is. It's not violent. Something violent happened to him, but he's not violent. Well, we go My thing is, Dan, the reason why this is proof that he's not an alien. Yeah. Is that Robert Porter is coming through subconsciously? Well, yeah, of course he is. So now are we saying that they're both in there at the same time and like this is him waking up? Because then my counter pitch to that is like once he goes catatonic, just put him in a sprinkler, see what happens. Nobody does that? You gotta try it at least once, right? You're kidding, right?

unknown 59:00

What do you mean?

SPEAKER_02 59:02

I mean, he's just reacting. I mean, yeah, of course the dude's still in there. He says that at the end.

SPEAKER_03 59:08

Sure. Right. So what I'm saying is, then once he goes catatonic at the end of the movie, no one's putting him in a sprinkler.

SPEAKER_02 59:17

Wake him up. No, the the doc is rolling him around and then talking, hoping that Pro hears him or something weird. I don't understand any of that.

SPEAKER_03 59:24

No, that's I know I'm that's what I'm saying. Put him in a sprinkler. See what happens. Fuck around, find out. Yeah. That's called science.

SPEAKER_02 59:35

I mean, every time we have a possession thing, you always have the thing where you're like, I know you're in there. And this is just a proof that he's he's there's still some residual of him in there.

SPEAKER_03 59:45

Sure.

SPEAKER_02 59:45

Or they don't like sprinklers on KPEX. That I expected that to be.

SPEAKER_03 59:49

Well, they seem to not have water, from what I can tell. Yeah, I don't know what that's about.

SPEAKER_02 59:54

Okay, he goes back, uh Doc goes back, he meets the boss who's Alfrey Woodard, who's

Regression Therapy And Mental Health Takes

SPEAKER_02 1:00:00

like gets like seven lines in the whole movie at most. And she's all like, he's a violent patient. That's what she says. She says it with a with with a serious urgency.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:09

Right, but then he tells her that he's not. He says he's not violent. Something violent happened to him, but he's not violent.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:16

But she thinks he's violent.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:17

Why does she think he's violent? She's not on the cake, because she's bad at her job. Okay, Dan. She's not listening. She just wants to get him out, check that box, send him off to someone else.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:29

Okay. So what they're gonna do is they're gonna regress him. We're gonna do regress regression hypnosis.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:35

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:35

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:37

Um you believe in hypnosis, Dan?

SPEAKER_03 1:00:44

I don't know. I don't know either. Yeah, I wasn't that wasn't I'm not it wasn't a judgmental thing. I'm just curious. It's a thing I've never investigated. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:54

I have a hard time I half of me says there's there's no way. The other half of me says, well, there might it might be possible. Because, you know, there's yeah, there's a lot of I mean, truthfully, it might be like the most significant thing you could truly investigate, right? Other than aliens, right? Aliens sure aliens, psychic powers, all that stuff, probably the most things, the most important things you could investigate, which would change, and religion. Those are the things you could you could investigate and try, you know, but all my investigations of religion comes out of zero. Um the aliens thing, same thing, zero. Uh psychic powers comes to zero.

SPEAKER_03 1:01:41

Talk to Tom DeLong, okay? Who's Tom DeLong? Oh, God, this is the lead singer Blink182, believes in aliens.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:47

Yeah, he's completely crazy. Isn't he? I don't know. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. No, come on, Tom.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:55

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:56

You've read the stuff about him, and the other bad guys can't go anywhere near him because he's so crazy, right?

SPEAKER_03 1:02:01

I refuse to cut that off. Refuse. What do you mean? Cut what off? It's gotta be life out there. Gotta be.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:10

Well, sure there's life there, but they're not being able to get into spaceships and come here.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:15

They might. How? Who knows? No. What do you mean how? We don't know.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:19

We're not that we're not an advanced, we're a BA3 planet, Dan. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You want my BA? I'll show you my BA. Whoa, whoa. Spare ass. Um I mean, we when you study any other, when you study any of those kind of things, it just all goes directly back to how human beings are, right? Religion, everything in religion is just about human beings. It's not about any kind of higher power, it's about controlling people and doing all these things, and the UFO stuff all comes out of religion. It all comes straight out of you know Christian religion stuff. If you look at the 50s UFO stuff, it's all like pampered with religious beliefs. And then when you look at the people, oh my god, the people are such a mess. Oh my god, they're such a mess. Just like all so conflicted.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:16

I I I understand that.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:26

The warrants, that guy kept a sex slave. Yeah, but she knew. She knew she was a sex slave? Yeah, you know it. No, the wife. The wife knew. So it's not like you was the wife was complicit in her husband keeping a sex slave. Come on. This is problematic stuff. These are these are not these can't be your primary sources of information.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:47

Yes, it is problematic, but they don't put that in the movies, okay? So it's fine. It works out fine. It's fine, dude. Uh no, that was yeah. The fucking warrant, dude. The warrants.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:01

Oh my god. You hear that stuff, and you're just like, oh, Jesus. What is happening?

SPEAKER_03 1:04:06

Oh, Jesus. I just think it's pretty egotistical to think that we're the only planet with life in an infinite solar system. Well, yeah, that's pretty lucky.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:19

I'm sure there's life all over the place, but unfortunately, it's on the other side of the spiral arm. Okay, all right. Then we're then we're in agreement. Okay. So boom. Uh Prok goes to Iceland.

SPEAKER_03 1:04:33

Uh always wanted to go to Iceland. Yeah. Iceland, Greenland. Those are like my two big ones that I'd like to go to.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:43

There's places you can go. Uh, prep comes back, he's in a tree, the doc goes down to talk to him, and he's all like, Where were you?

SPEAKER_03 1:04:51

Yeah, you can't leave, bro.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:53

You're not supposed to leave. He's like, Who left? You didn't, you know, you know, whatever. Uh, yeah, yeah. So now we start doing the regression therapy, which is just basically setting up that you know, inside of Groat Pro is this other guy who's Mr. Palmer. Robert Porter.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:15

Robert Porter.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:17

And these these regression therapies, first of all, he's regressing him with hypnosis, but somehow he's got like another guy that uh monitoring all of his vitals during a hypnosis regression, which I I don't believe. I don't know. I don't know, dude. So that was weird. So we do we do three like three sessions with that, or two sessions, maybe three. Um now all the patients know that that pro it's gonna take one person to KPAX. They all want to go so that we set up an essay contest.

SPEAKER_03 1:05:51

Adorable.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:53

See, that's the whole thing is when you take a whole mental hospital. And then you turn them all into kindergartners, vying for the attention of the new cute girl. It just becomes so weird. Hypnosis 2. Yeah. We we start trying to figure out stuff. I don't care.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:16

Boom! I don't care about his terrible life before that caused all this. Okay, damn. I don't care.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:24

Boom! Oh my god. Howie just tried to kill Ernie. So we go see Ernie. Howie has gone in there, I believe, strangle Ernie literally to death or to the to the edge of death.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:38

I think could to death though, because he they bring him back, he says, right? I think so. I I wasn't quite sure.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:45

So Howie commits homicide.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:53

Howie in a medical hospital. You know, because he lives. Okay.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:00

Ernie lives. So that's fine. And this was this was how a second task put to him of three by Pro Ed. Pro. Yeah. Um Yeah, just kill him. And then through this thing, goes, hey guys, you know what? I was I was dead or almost dead, and it was okay. So now all of my worries and psychosis are gone.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:30

I mean, if only we knew it was that simple. Just choke some people out. Just get uh you know, some wrestlers over there, put them in a sleeper, knock them out cured. Problem solved, it's pretty good.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:51

The doc goes into the arts and crafts room and sees all the great UFO arts and crafts that everyone is making.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:57

Wonderful stuff. Very confusing though, because he doesn't travel on UFOs. So and they know that. Okay. So it's a little disappointing to see how stupid they all are.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:09

Uh we do some more hypnosis. We uh Pro takes off his uh the guy that's not pro takes off his clothes and then wades into a river.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:22

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:23

Current is too strong. And then he tries to talk to Pete, but Proat won't let him talk to Pete. And then Prote goes full anguish. Anguish and then the doc brings him out, and then he's back to his normal.

SPEAKER_03 1:08:38

There's a line here that I do like when uh he's the doc is basically like, you can help him, you can help him. And Prot says, as his friend, I can't. I won't. Why won't he help him? He doesn't want to save him.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:53

Why not?

SPEAKER_03 1:08:54

Because the the truth is too painful. Well, can he get better? I don't want why I don't want to save him.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:00

Why doesn't Prot just fix him and tell him to like do three stupid tasks, and that'll be a good thing.

SPEAKER_03 1:09:05

Why not? Because he can't, man, because that's all bullshit. Why doesn't he take him back to Capex? Well, I assume it has something to do with them inhabiting the same body, so then when they got there, it'd be super weird. I'm not totally sure.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:18

It's confusing. So Doc's on the train going back home. When he picked up pro from that last thing, he picked up some little weird thing and he drops it on the floor, and then a panhandler says, Here's this your thing, and he takes it and pencil. It's a pencil. It's a pencil pencil nub because he's been writing in his little book, but there's like some little bit of information on there for For seven years.

unknown 1:09:45

What?

SPEAKER_03 1:09:46

Because that's how long Prot's been using that pencil, probably. You know? Five years. You don't think so? How many? He's been here five years. Sorry. I'm so sorry. Jesus Christ. You're right. I don't I don't know anything. So with this I didn't take any notes.

Santa Rosa Backstory And The Big Line

SPEAKER_03 1:10:00

All right.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:00

With this clue, he realizes that the place is Santa Rosa, immediately books a flight to Santa Rosa, goes there, meets the sheriff. The sheriff takes him to this cabin. We find out that Do you think work paid for that?

SPEAKER_03 1:10:13

Do you think it's a work trip? You think you put it on the work card? That's pretty cool. No comment.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:19

Um, that's like movie logic. Oh I can just do anything.

SPEAKER_03 1:10:23

Um what are you talking about, dude?

SPEAKER_02 1:10:25

We find out that the guy who is is inhabiting had a wife and child. Drifter comes along, rapes the wife, kills them both. He comes home, snaps his neck, takes off his clothes, goes, jumps, throws himself in the river, and dies or disappears.

SPEAKER_03 1:10:44

Yeah, body was never found.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:46

And this is this is the point where Tony's crying.

SPEAKER_03 1:10:48

Oh my god, that's so strange. I've already been crying, man. I cry during that therapy session. Oh, I cry all the time. Which therapy session did you cry? When he's when he's uh when they're trying to push and he's like, I'm not, I won't save him. Okay, that's such an it's such a it's such a heart-wrenching moment for me because it's him. Well, I mean, you know, I guess it depends on where you live. Uh, but he's like, as his friend, I I'm not gonna save him because it's too painful for him to keep living. I get it. I need to let him go. That's very sad. Loss is tough, man.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:29

And then he goes and he sees the sprinkler and a swing, and he realizes that the sprinkler and the swing We're all part of it.

SPEAKER_03 1:11:36

It's all right. It's all triggering it.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:38

Yeah. And he goes home and now he can watch his daughter sleep, realizing that he solved this other mystery. Now he can get back to his life.

SPEAKER_03 1:11:49

Well, it's not just that, it's also that he's like, I I still have these people. I need to cherish them because they could be gone. I'm very lucky that they're still here and I need to pay more attention to them. It's his wake-up moment, you know?

SPEAKER_02 1:12:03

And do you do that, Tony?

SPEAKER_03 1:12:05

Did you finally wake up and I think I'll get there someday, you know? Give me another five to ten. Maybe I'll have a wake-up moment. Do you think people can change like that? No, I don't.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:19

Is that why you would get emotional?

SPEAKER_03 1:12:21

Because you like realize that only in the only in the movies can you ever get your Hollywood. Uh no, I mean, I think I think you can want to, and I think in the moment you can, but I would bet within a year he's back to being his old self. That's just my cynical view of life. Yeah. Interesting. I know. I'm a bad guy.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:42

They have a big party for uh oh, he apologizes to his wife, and he says, I found what I was looking for.

SPEAKER_03 1:12:52

I wish I didn't.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:54

I didn't write that down because I don't.

SPEAKER_03 1:12:56

I think he's why why does he wish he didn't find it? Because he wants to believe. He so badly wants to believe.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:03

Why can't he just believe that K Pax is in there from another planet?

SPEAKER_03 1:13:08

Because that is insane. Why? That's crazy talk, Dan. Two two spiritual minds inhabiting the same body? That's nonsense. Uh but he just he found the like it, you know, the mystery's always better than the ants.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:23

Okay, Tony. You're walking, you're walking home late, late one night. You're like Okay, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:13:28

You're out in the park. I never walk at night, by the way, but continue.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:32

You're out in the park, play basketball with the boys. You like I gotta crew? Yeah, there's a whole new crew that that hangs out at the basketball court. They're young, they've taken in an old person like you, really old stable person.

SPEAKER_03 1:13:47

That's really okay.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:48

Well, I bet you most of the time, but they put you in for 30 seconds each game, right?

SPEAKER_03 1:13:53

Well, that's about as much as I can take. So that actually works out for both of us.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:57

And mostly, mostly you're just there to try to slow somebody down because you got fouls to give, so you give fouls. You're damn right. I'll put a body on someone right now. Okay. These guys, they're young, so they can be up late. You're on the bench falling asleep.

SPEAKER_03 1:14:13

Yeah, that's that you know, that's right.

SPEAKER_02 1:14:15

Then they're like, game over, and everybody, everybody, they go to their cool motorcycles. You don't have a cool motorcycle yet. You gotta walk home. Wow. None of them put you on the back.

SPEAKER_03 1:14:24

They're just like, because they got hot girls. I I don't know if I'd fit on the back of anyone's motorcycle. That would be very tough.

SPEAKER_02 1:14:30

You're walking home, you know, through the through the Los Angeles Hills, the Glendale Hills. Very scary.

SPEAKER_03 1:14:35

Up and down, spooky. Would never do that.

SPEAKER_02 1:14:37

Yep. Boom, they're in front of you, a werewolf. Yeah. You know, he's like, it's not a wolf, it's a human man werewolf. Yeah. It begins to chase you. I'm gonna lose that very quickly, yeah. It claws you, but then just then shit. The sun rises.

unknown 1:14:59

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:00

The werewolf disappears into the woods.

SPEAKER_03 1:15:03

Right.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:05

This story must have had a point.

SPEAKER_03 1:15:08

I'm I'm yeah, I'm st I'm enthralled. Does that help? I'm ready. Would that change your whole life? I'd I'd probably I would try at least once to build some sort of shelter. Chain me up. No, no, no.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:23

You're not you're not infected. You're not infected. He scratched me. He didn't scratch you, he just cut with all your colours.

SPEAKER_03 1:15:29

Okay. Okay. All right. Yeah. So what now?

SPEAKER_02 1:15:33

Well, you've seen a supernatural being, you're convinced it's a supernatural being. You got right, you got right in your face, and you're just like, I know exactly what this is not a prosthetic, this is not a guy in a suit. Yeah, he got right in your face, but then something happened and he ran off into the woods. You're like, this is not an animal, this is a werewolf or something equivalent, wolf monster. Yeah. Would that change your life? I mean, it would change your life in that you wouldn't be walking home by yourself. I understand that.

SPEAKER_03 1:16:03

But first of all, I already wouldn't do that, so that part wouldn't change. But the only thing that would change is that every time I spoke to someone, I'd be like, Told you so, you stupid idiot. I told you they were real. I win, you lose, and then they'd all lock me up. Um I mean, that would be a beautiful moment. Would it confirm a belief? Do you believe in the supernatural, Tony? I do. Not necessarily werewolves, obviously, but I do believe in the supervisor.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:32

If you didn't have a supernatural, if you had a supernatural encounter, all it would do would be to reinforce your general beliefs. But you wouldn't change, you wouldn't be like, I need to hunt werewolves, I need to do this, I do that. You would just be like, I was right.

SPEAKER_03 1:16:46

I already want to hunt ghosts, so I just don't because yeah, I have to make money. You know what I mean? So like I can't really spend a lot of time doing other stuff. Um, but I believe, baby, I believe in a lot of stuff that probably isn't true, but I really, really want it to be.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:03

Okay, the doc is back. You want to hunt ghosts with me, Dan?

SPEAKER_03 1:17:07

Someday. That's a no.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:11

There's uh no, it is a no. I'd love to, but I don't got the I know. We got stuff to do, man.

The Departure, The Reveal, And The Epilogue

SPEAKER_02 1:17:18

Uh there's they have the leaving party. In the middle of the leaving party, Prot says, there's one thing you get extra points on your essay if you all go to bed now, and they all go to bed.

SPEAKER_03 1:17:28

Yeah, so he's like their dad now? I don't know. It's it's a really I don't know. Uh that's fairly well.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:35

Doc has one last session and they drink scotch, and Prot's like, go see your son.

SPEAKER_03 1:17:42

The most alien thing he does is drink that scotch down all in one gulp without any sort of like reaction to it. It would have been like the you should have gone like I mean, I know I'm a baby, but like that shit burns, man. Yeah, you can't do that much at one time. That's crazy. Alcohol's disgusting. Yeah, you're right about that.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:07

Uh, and then he's like, go see your son, because we don't have families in love on Capex, and you got it here.

SPEAKER_03 1:18:14

See, but he's he's turning a corner. He's understanding, he's realizing that it's important to have connections.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:23

You see, that's the thing. If this whole movie was like, you know, he's like, I'm just out here eating fruit, but now I'm forced.

SPEAKER_03 1:18:30

He loves that fruit.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:31

You know, forced to like interact with these people, and then he finally comes to understand what is good about humans. If he was like shitting on humans at the beginning, like, you humans, eye for an eye, you're a piece of shit.

SPEAKER_03 1:18:43

And then he's like he says that less aggressively. He's like, it's he says something about it being very stupid. And we don't we don't believe in that on our planet because we're smarter than you.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:54

So the doc doesn't know what to do, but then he's like, Ah, I gotta show you the yearbook. There you are in the yearbook. And then Pro just looks at it as like, Take good care of him when I'm gone.

SPEAKER_03 1:19:06

That's uh that's another beautiful moment. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:19:09

Uh the wife shows up, she brought him food, she feeds him, he goes to sleep, he oversleeps, he's running. He's like, oh no, he overslept. Pro's leaving at 5 51 a.m. Eastern Standard Time. He runs down the stairs. Why doesn't he just set an alarm? And why did the people just come get him? Because they were all watching.

SPEAKER_03 1:19:28

Yeah, like she was they they're in that uh the viewing room, I don't know, whatever you call it, like the security guy, and he's like, two minutes, where's the doc? And she's like, Oh, I'll buzz him. He said he was gonna see you at 4 a.m. You didn't buzz him for the last hour and a half? Like, what the fuck are you doing? You're fired, lady. Ridiculous. It's pretty funny.

SPEAKER_02 1:19:47

He gets down there, the cameras fail. He gets there. Yeah. And boom, he looks in there, and there's this light and no pro, but then he looks under the bed and there's Robert Porter. Under the bed. Comatose.

SPEAKER_03 1:20:05

Yeah, tough stuff.

SPEAKER_02 1:20:07

But luckily, Bess is gone, so he took Bess with him. Um, and then we then we have epilogue. The epilogue is the Howie, uh, the murderer. He's okay, and he's uh working at the public library where he could murder again.

SPEAKER_03 1:20:24

Yeah, he just strangles people every once in a while.

SPEAKER_02 1:20:27

Ernie Ernie's working on becoming a crisis counselor, Bess is missing, and that's that's it.

SPEAKER_03 1:20:34

There's a nice moment where there's the tiniest bit of a smile on K-Pax's face. I love it. It's beautiful.

SPEAKER_00 1:20:44

Oh, okay.

SPEAKER_03 1:20:45

Because the doc like leans down and he's like, Bess is missing. You wouldn't know anything about that, would you? And there's just the tiniest, the tiniest movement in Kevin's mouth, and it's a it's a nice little moment.

SPEAKER_02 1:20:58

Uh, we get some K Pax voiceover about the universe expanding, and how each time it expands and unexpands, we all go through it again, and each so you better get it right the first time because you're gonna have to keep on living it.

SPEAKER_03 1:21:13

You're gonna relive that mistake millions and millions of times.

SPEAKER_02 1:21:16

And then he goes and meets Aaron Paul at the trade station where the movie began.

SPEAKER_03 1:21:23

Beautiful. Beautiful stuff.

SPEAKER_02 1:21:25

See, I think this is the difference between the two of us, Tony. You're willing to sit there through a movie and construct the movie you want to see from the bones that this movie gives you. I look at the bones and I'm like, well, why don't why didn't you actually, you know, Where's the meat? Why don't you yeah, why don't you get bones all from the same animal as opposed to a bunch of random bones that you've you've thrown into the soup mix? That's my point.

SPEAKER_03 1:21:50

My point is, you know, it's like maybe variety's the spice of life, alright? Enjoy those bones.

SPEAKER_02 1:21:57

Most movies follow the tropes. You know, the government's gonna want to grab this guy because he's an alien. He says he's an alien, he can do alien things. Or the doc is disillusioned, the alien drags him back through. The alien is disillusioned, the doc drags him back through. Yeah. And then they all work it on the end. This movie's like, yeah, that's stuff sort of happening, but there's a lot of random stuff, an essay writing. And a bluebird, and the whole hospital cheers.

SPEAKER_03 1:22:23

I'm just like, why is the hospital cheer? He's curing mental illness. I mean, what more do you want?

SPEAKER_02 1:22:29

And he's curing mental illness through common sense.

SPEAKER_00 1:22:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:22:36

Anything else you want to say about this movie, Tony?

SPEAKER_03 1:22:40

Um, so I agree that the mental health aspect, not great. Uh probably not as problematic as a lot of movies, but still problematic. Sure, but still, it's definitely problematic. And it's it's a viewpoint that is the problem. Like, I the things that you do with the viewpoint aren't necessarily terrible, but they are like, Really, guy? You sure about that? That's where you want to go. Okay. Sweet. Uh so not not huge on that aspect, but everything else I love. Okay. I love it.

SPEAKER_02 1:23:11

That's a weird one. Um, now we talk about something we like.

Bonus Hate And What We Watch Next

SPEAKER_02 1:23:15

Tony, what did you like or bonus hate? I think you have bonus hate for this.

SPEAKER_03 1:23:18

I'm gonna do one of each because uh we watched something that I might consider one of the worst shows I've ever seen in my life.

SPEAKER_01 1:23:26

Wow.

SPEAKER_03 1:23:27

Uh, we watched Mindy Kaling's new Not Suitable for Work. I think it's one of the worst things I've ever seen in my life. Um, and I just you'll probably love this, but a lot of reviews that I read are like, it's a friend's knockoff. It is not anything. That is the most insulting thing you could ever say about friends, and it's ridiculous. Um, so it's not that. Just everyone knows it is not that at all. But it is really bad, Dan. Uh, just just terrible. Where can you watch this thing? Uh oh, not suitable for work is on what is it? Is it Apple? Is it Hulu? Shoot. Now I'm gonna have to watch an episode. It's not suitable for work. It's on Hulu. Oh, it's on Hulu, wow. Uh yeah, so just give it give it a watch. Enjoy yourself. It's only one person can act in the whole show.

SPEAKER_02 1:24:24

Um okay, wait, wait, but let's ask the big question. Is it worse than the Frasier reboot?

SPEAKER_03 1:24:30

Yes. Because at least the Frasier reboot has Frasier. You know, like everything around him is garbage, but Kelsey Grammar is still at least there. Yeah. There's still this has almost nothing. There's one girl, there's five, I think five main characters. One of the girls is like, wow, she'd be great in a real show. Everyone else, shh, I just retire. Um, I so that show is really bad. On the flip side, uh, you know, World Cup. Come on, baby. We're we're living it, we're having fun. Uh, I'm, you know, pro USA only in this context a little bit. Yeah. And they had a great, they had a great match, 4-1. That was lovely to see, but I I World Cup's so much fun. We have what, four or five weeks of of the beautiful game. I'm very excited. I think like 39 days or something. It's a lot of days. It's a lot. It's a lot. Well, there's what 40, 48 teams this year or something? Incredible stuff. All right, what about you? What are you watching?

SPEAKER_02 1:25:33

We kept clicking over to the live stream of them prying Donald Trump's name off of the Kennedy Center. It's like this, it was just like this very slow building of a of a scaffolding, and then eventually, after I'd gone to sleep, they they put a tarp over it so you couldn't even see them remove the things. And I was just like, how great is it that that is like live streamed on multiple channels all day? And there were a lot of people, yeah, take it down. I'm like, oh my god, those poor guys that had to build that scaffolding. Because we got scaffolding across the street, you know. It's a you know, you feel you feel for scaffold scaffolders.

SPEAKER_03 1:26:14

Not great. Not a great job.

SPEAKER_02 1:26:16

Having put them together ourselves. Uh, yeah, pretty interesting. Tony, we need a movie. And I've got a I've got a new one on here that really okay.

SPEAKER_03 1:26:35

Well, I do that next week, can't we? And we've got a we've got a bunch of good stuff coming out soon, by the way, which I'm very excited about. Oh, what do we have coming out? But I don't know if you've uh been around, but something released yesterday in the theaters by one of the greats, Steven Spielberg. Disclosure day has finally come out. I have not seen it yet. I really, really want to. But in honor of that, I was like, let's go back to uh the Spielberg Ouvre. And I really thought about doing something that would piss you off, and I decided that I'm not gonna do that, at least yet. Um, and I think since we did War of the Worlds with Ice Cube, let's do Tom Cruise's War of the Worlds because I saw this opening night at midnight. Yeah, it's the only time I've ever seen it. I don't remember anything other than I remember being like, what the hell just happened in the third act? This is the dumbest ending to a movie ever. I don't remember it. I just remember being mad. So I was like, in honor of Spielberg, let's go back to one of his other alien movies. Let's check it out.

SPEAKER_02 1:27:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:27:39

Um, it's mostly a good movie. See, that's what I feel like that's what I remember. But it the whatever happens at some point towards the end made me so mad that I haven't watched that movie in 21 years.

SPEAKER_02 1:27:54

I could tell you exactly what it is. I don't want to know I'm not gonna tell you, but I could tell you exactly what it is, and this. Movie has um a plot device in it that is one of my favorite plot devices in any movie of all times. And I thought I mean I must have talked about it on here before. I'm not gonna talk about it now. Maybe you have.

SPEAKER_03 1:28:11

Yeah, I yeah, I don't remember.

SPEAKER_02 1:28:12

We've done a lot of movies because it is it's we have done a lot of movies and we've talked about a lot of things, but there's one one thing, one choice in this movie that I love and is one of my favorite things of all time in any movies, and it's it's a it's a I don't know if I'll call it a trick, but it's a it's a thing that they do that is just brilliant. And and the way he sort of lays it out is is you know, Spielberg is a great filmmaker. It was interesting, I was watching it because everybody's talking Spielberg now because of this movie, and somebody was doing like Spielberg's best movie of the 70s, his worst movie of the 70s, so sure. And they were just they were just going back and forth, and I think it was one of them, maybe the early 2000s. They said Munich was his worst of that time period, and Munich I actually liked. So Munich was deep.

SPEAKER_03 1:29:04

Did you know the movie that I almost was gonna pick? Nope. Really? What was it? Just tell me. Catch me if you can.

SPEAKER_02 1:29:11

Oh no, that that movie is that face right there. I I'd be happy to do that movie because the same thing with that movie is with what you have on War of the Worlds, is I hated that movie from beginning to end, and I can't tell you why, because it it didn't interest it didn't leave any impression on me. And that the whole story of Catch Me in a Can, Catch Me If You Can, all bullshit. So it's based on a true story. That true story, all bullshit, all made up by the guy. The guy that's made it the whole thing up.

SPEAKER_03 1:29:41

Has he admitted that? Really? Okay, well now, I mean, we're definitely gonna do it. It's on my list of movies to do, and I was like, um, that that movie felt like it should be an alien-centered movie.

SPEAKER_02 1:29:52

Yeah, yeah, yeah. That movie I hate, and I I'm sure I'm gonna watch it and I'm gonna remember the exact reasons why I hate it. Sure.

SPEAKER_03 1:29:59

Yeah. Uh I just remember my brother is obsessed with that movie. Obsessed. He's like, oh, it's the best movie ever. He's got the poster on his wall, and I watched it one time with him. I was like, this is a piece of shit. What are we talking about here? So I don't know why I don't know if I was just angry at him and that's why I didn't like it, but that's another movie that I've only seen once in my life.

SPEAKER_02 1:30:19

And this decade by decade thing, they said that that was Spielberg's best movie of whatever decade it came out in.

SPEAKER_03 1:30:25

That can be right. Are you listening to The Ringer? Because that's my brother loves The Ringer, and he's like, Oh, these guys are the are brilliant. They know everything. The Ringer. I don't know what that is. It's it's a podcast network, it doesn't matter.

SPEAKER_02 1:30:40

Anywho. So we're gonna do War of the Worlds. We've done the we've done the OG War of the Worlds. Now we're gonna do the the middling War of the Worlds. Yeah. And we'll uh we'll we'll watch Spielberg. Yeah, there's some good stuff in this movie.

SPEAKER_03 1:30:53

So I'm ex- Yeah, I'm excited. I rewatched the trailer just to make sure I was thinking of the right thing. And I definitely am.

SPEAKER_02 1:31:00

So but there's some other I remember now there's some other there's some Spielberg setups at the beginning that you're just like, oh why is he? He I'm excited, I'm excited to see. I was watching a thing where he was uh he went to he's they've got this building or whatever full of all of the props and all his his movie history, his own personal movie history. That's pretty cool. You know, he's like, here's the E.T. bike, Elliot's bike, and then you know, goes back there. Here's the Ralph McQuery, you know, primary painting of the close encounters, big the mothership. You know, he's just like, whoa, you can't even imagine what the the art that's in that space. 100%.

SPEAKER_03 1:31:46

I don't know if it's I assume it's still there. I haven't been on the Backlots tour in a while at Universal Studios, but the ride goes through the plane crash set of War of the Worlds. And it was it's if if that's still part of that ride, it is super cool.

SPEAKER_02 1:32:00

Oh cool. Okay, well, I'm gonna go eat lunch. Beautiful. Leave us a thumbs up, subscribe, or leave us a comment. Those are three things you can do. Why not? And uh we'll be back. Why not? We'll be back next uh week talking about some War of the Worlds.

SPEAKER_03 1:32:16

Ghostly disclosure day. Goodbye, everybody. Hey, Quatchem.